Don't go leave the list just because I have a differing opinion. One of my pet peeves is that if car gas was being used, it would be the cause for a wing falling off. >GRIN>
Cy Galley - Chair,
AirVenture Emergency Aircraft Repair
A 46 Year Service Project of Chapter 75
EAA Safety Programs Editor - TC
New address - cgalley@mchsi.com
EAA Sport Pilot
'----- Original Message -----
From: tonyb42uk
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 6:21 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Re: Mogas - UK accident
Hello Cy,
Please read the AAIB report.
I think you will find it was not my speculation that the cause of
Richard's accident was the use of mogas.
It was the opinion of those professional investigators at Farnborough
that inspected the wreckage, authorised the analysis of the fuel and
various engine parts by experts in their field and finally wrote the
accident report. That this could occur in the cooler British climate
whereas there seems to be a similar problem in the USA is as much a
mystery to me. I attempted to make that clear in my posting.
The report records the temperature had been up to 21 degrees C during
the day of the accident.
It was certainly not my intention to give "car gas a bad rap".
My own speculation was more about whether the quality of the Mogas
purchased in the UK differs from that available in the US. Following
the reports publication in 1999 I asked around about this apparant
variation of volatility and if there was a significant differences,
but never found a helpful answer.
I thought long and hard about whether I should contribute to thread
as it bound to be controversial.
May be my decision to contribute via the forum was a mistake after
all - but I said I hoped some of you might find the report useful. As
I understand it, the purpose of a AAIB investigation and the
subsequent publication of the report is not to a portion blame, but
as a measure to limit the likelihood of a similar event.
Thank you for your comments, Tony
--- In fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com, "cgalley" wrote:
>
> Your speculation on the cause of this accident is just that and I
would suggest that car gas had nothing at all to do with the
accident. You are giving car gas a bad rap.
>
> First, unless you can tell me with a straight face that the
temperature was approaching 100° in England, the vapor lock is highly
improbable.
>
>
> Having been in England in July when it rained 12 of the 13 days and
never got over 60° while I was there, a more likely cause might be
carburetor Icing.
>
> Cool days of high humidity makes carb ice happen. After the engine
quits and the plane is forced down; the ice just melts leaving not a
trace to show that there was ice. Just repeating that car gas causes
all engine failures is not very realistic even when car gas is the
fuel.
>
> Ironically, the worse case of carb Ice I ever had was on a 80° hazy
evening in Iowa. Carb ice can happen even when temps approach 100°
>
>
>
> Cy Galley
> EAA Safety Programs Editor
> Always looking for ideas and articles for EAA Sport Pilot
> New address - cgalley@...
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: tonyb42uk
> To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Sunday, November 18, 2007 8:00 AM
> Subject: [fairchildclub] Mogas - UK accident
>
>
> Hello to all,
> Some of you on this forum will know me as a member of the
Fairchild
> Club and of my long standing interest and continuing research
into
> the production and service history of the Fairchild M-62's and F-
> 24's. I must make it clear that I am neither a professional
> historian nor have I any practical experience of owning or flying
any
> aircraft.
>
> I read with great interest the thread relating to Mogas and have
> debated for several days whether or not to contribute. In August
> 1998 there was an accident involving a Fairchild PT-19A in the UK
> which had fatal consequences for the restorer, owner and pilot,
> Richard Fox.
>
> I met Richard Fox on three occasions and we had corresponded on
the
> history and provenance of his ex-Uruguayan PT-19A for sometime.
This
> was not the first vintage aircraft Richard had restored and in my
> judgement his skill, workmanship and his attention to detail were
> first class. It was therefore a great shock when, during the
evening
> of August 15, 1998, I first heard of his fatal accident .
>
> Even before the accident report was published one of AAIB
> investigators made it clear to me that after eliminating several
> possibilities suggested by the eye witness reports and after an
> analysis of the fuel remaining in the tanks (fortunately, there
was
> no post crash fire) they were coming to the conclusion that
a "vapour
> lock" in the fuel lines had occurred and that the volatility of
the
> motor gasoline was the major cause.
>
> The accident report can be read or downloaded via either of the
> following links, assuming your computer has Adobe Reader software:
>
>
http://www.aaib.dft.gov.uk/publications/bulletins/april_1999/fairchild
> _500172.cfm
>
>
http://www.aaib.dft.gov.uk/cms_resources/dft_avsafety_pdf_500172.pdf
>
> There are several points in the text that I feel are worth
further
> consideration:
> Whilst not familiar with Woburn Park, the mention of the parkland
> containing many trees probably indicates why the pilot was unable
to
> attempt a forced landing straight ahead when the engine first
> faltered and why he initiated a turn, possibly to avoid these
trees,
> which developed into a spin immediately after the engine failed
> completely. I am told these obstructions were relevant in a Gipsy
> Moth accident at an earlier Moth Rally at Woburn Park.
>
> I felt at the time of the publication of the report, and still
feel
> today, that the potential consequences of using Mogas in the UK
were
> not highlighted sufficiently. I cannot comment as to the
situation
> in the USA, but understand that Mogas can be approved for use in
the
> Fairchild M-62 in the USA. I also understand it is commonly used
by
> operators there and despite the ambient temperatures reached in
some
> US states (recalling my own visit to Oshkosh in August 1999!)
being
> much higher than that reached on a summer's afternoon in the UK -
> there does not seem to be a history of this particular problem on
> the western side of the pond. To the best of my knowledge there
> have only ever been three other civil registered M-62's operated
in
> the UK and AFAIK, none of these suffered this type of engine
failure.
>
> From what is said in the AAIB report it seems likely the problem
may
> lie with the fuel Richard was using, and possibly, with the
standards
> set in the UK for gasoline for automobile use. If the problem of
the
> volatility quality of UK Mogas was the root cause then this is of
> little consequence to most readers of this forum. However, there
may
> well be other operators of US vintage aircraft outside the
States,
> who whilst not having the official approval for the use of Mogas
in
> their machines, are well aware this is approved for their
aircraft in
> the USA and consequently make regular use of it, specially if
like
> Richard, they operate out of a small strip with no Avgas
facilities.
> It may be that the AAIB took the view that as the fuel being used
was
> not approved for use in this type of aircraft by UK authorities
and
> was therefore the responsibility of the desceased owner and as
there
> were no other current British-registered examples it needed no
> further action beyond the usual publication of accident report.
>
> I would imagine the circumstances of this accident are more
relevant
> in the case of a low-wing aircraft where the fuel is lifted from
wing
> tanks or the center section and less so in the case of an
aircraft
> where the fuel is initially gravity fed from tanks in high set
wings,
> such as the Model 24.
>
> Having owned an ex-British Army of the Rhine 'Lightweight' Land
Rover
> for a period of twelve years, 'vapour lock' was a problem I had
heard
> of prior to these events, and had some personal experience of.
> However, the embrassment of a failure of a vehicle to respond to
your
> right foot are not generally as serious as that of an aircraft
engine
> failure.
>
> Hope some of you might find the AAIB report of interest.
>
> Tony Broadhurst
>
>
>
>
>
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>
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