Re: Starters

Bob and Dot Haas · Post by **Bob and Dot Haas** » Sun Mar 31, 2002 8:10 am

'Any one, I met with a bunch of QB's yesterday, My Pt was on display, and
the subject came up," how do you start it? My reply I used to crank it but
I've installed a self commencer. There was then a discussion on the type
of cranking
Method. I maintained there was only one type of cranking starter and that
was a direct drive engaged by a spring loaded
One way locking dog. Several of these Pilots insisted that in several
different flight schools in 1942. using Ranger powered PT 19's were started
with an inertial type windup crank, commonly found on radial engines. I
confirmed that they were
Not referring to PT 23's but in fact long nose Pt 19's.

So, who has seen a Ranger with an inertial starter, and is it on the
equipment list?
Bob Haas Buckingham Army Air Field, Ft Myers Fl'

jstreat360@aol.com · Post by **jstreat360@aol.com** » Sun Mar 31, 2002 10:39 am

'Bob,

I believe my father has one on his PT right after the war. He use to crank
it, engage it on his way up the wing from the front side and stroke the
wobble pump in one motion. This got him in trouble with the CAA once. A
younger pilot with at PT witnessed this and followed suite. PT got away from
him and he hit the Control Tower. The CAA violated my Dad for teaching bad
habits. Unknown if it was ever approved, war brings on different ways of
approaching and resolving the needs.

Jamie S. Treat A&P/IA

Visit my F-24 Web Site:
http://hometown.aol.com/ftreat9191/AIRCRAFTRESTORATIONREPAIRindex.html">Aircraft Restoration & Repair

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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]'

Michael Denest · Post by **Michael Denest** » Sun Mar 31, 2002 12:16 pm

'Inertia starters are not listed on the TCDS. Inertia
starters were used on Stearman's with Continentals and
Lycomings. Time makes a lot of us forget.

Mike

--- Bob and Dot Haas
wrote:

>
> Any one, I met with a bunch of QB's yesterday, My
> Pt was on display, and
> the subject came up," how do you start it? My reply
> I used to crank it but
> I've installed a self commencer. There was then a
> discussion on the type
> of cranking
> Method. I maintained there was only one type of
> cranking starter and that
> was a direct drive engaged by a spring loaded
> One way locking dog. Several of these Pilots
> insisted that in several
> different flight schools in 1942. using Ranger
> powered PT 19's were started
> with an inertial type windup crank, commonly found
> on radial engines. I
> confirmed that they were
> Not referring to PT 23's but in fact long nose Pt
> 19's.
>
> So, who has seen a Ranger with an inertial starter,
> and is it on the
> equipment list?
> Bob Haas Buckingham Army Air Field, Ft Myers
> Fl
>
>

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Christopher John Shaker · Mon Apr 01, 2002 1:09 pm

'I saw a Great Lakes equipped with a Ranger with the windup
crank at Aurora, OR. Jack owns it. Gorgeous, irish linen, red dope.

Chris Shaker

----- Original Message -----
From: Bob and Dot Haas
To: Fairchild Club (E-mail)
Sent: Sunday, March 31, 2002 6:09 AM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Starters

Any one, I met with a bunch of QB's yesterday, My Pt was on display, and
the subject came up," how do you start it? My reply I used to crank it but
I've installed a self commencer. There was then a discussion on the type
of cranking
Method. I maintained there was only one type of cranking starter and that
was a direct drive engaged by a spring loaded
One way locking dog. Several of these Pilots insisted that in several
different flight schools in 1942. using Ranger powered PT 19's were started
with an inertial type windup crank, commonly found on radial engines. I
confirmed that they were
Not referring to PT 23's but in fact long nose Pt 19's.

So, who has seen a Ranger with an inertial starter, and is it on the
equipment list?
Bob Haas Buckingham Army Air Field, Ft Myers Fl

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'

jim Chybicki · Post by **jim Chybicki** » Tue Mar 11, 2003 4:35 pm

'Hi Gang!
Can anyone tell me if the Eclipse/Bendix Type 393 Model 4, (which is
used on the PT-19/26 200 HP Rangers), be used on a F24. The Ranger
Manual indicates the Type 393 Model 4 is a hand crank. Is it only
Hand crank? or does it have any electrical connections? If not, does
anyone have a Starter for sale for the 200 HP Ranger.
JIM'

John Berendt · Post by **John Berendt** » Wed Mar 12, 2003 9:40 am

'Jim,
The eclipse 393 is just a had crank starter. you would have to modify the
engine mount to use it on the F24. The electrical starter for the Ranger is
the Eclipse/bendix E-80. I would contact J & C aero engines at (270)
527-2208. John Ferrero knows of a source for them. They are not cheap!

John Berendt

----- Original Message -----
From: "jim Chybicki"
To:
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2003 4:35 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Starters

> Hi Gang!
> Can anyone tell me if the Eclipse/Bendix Type 393 Model 4, (which is
> used on the PT-19/26 200 HP Rangers), be used on a F24. The Ranger
> Manual indicates the Type 393 Model 4 is a hand crank. Is it only
> Hand crank? or does it have any electrical connections? If not, does
> anyone have a Starter for sale for the 200 HP Ranger.
> JIM
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

'

Thekortas@aol.com · Post by **Thekortas@aol.com** » Wed Mar 12, 2003 11:28 am

'Hello John! Hope all is well!
Further to the starter question...do you know if anyone has ever successfully gotten an approval for a more modern starter in lieu of the Eclipse? I am not aware of it. But, it sure seems like it might be a nice alternative to have something lighter and powerful that is more readily available. Just a question.
Regards,
Steve Korta'

james chybicki · Post by **james chybicki** » Wed Mar 12, 2003 3:22 pm

'Hi!
There is a guy on Barnstormers selling the Jack and
Heintz JH6 Starter on Barnstormers. He indicates its a
replacement for the E-80. I have asked for FAA 337 of
other confirmation the interchangeablity....No
response. I emailed Jamie Treat, and he does not
think it is an approved alternate.
Has anyone else heard of the J&H-6
JIM
--- Thekortas@aol.com wrote:

> Hello John! Hope all is well!
> Further to the starter question...do you know if
> anyone has ever successfully gotten an approval for
> a more modern starter in lieu of the Eclipse? I am
> not aware of it. But, it sure seems like it might
> be a nice alternative to have something lighter and
> powerful that is more readily available. Just a
> question.
> Regards,
> Steve Korta
>

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Jamie Treat · Post by **Jamie Treat** » Wed Mar 12, 2003 6:01 pm

'All,

I spoke with B&C Specialties a few months ago for an alternate starter for the E-80 in support of future new Warner Engine production. The E-80 is back in production for a small fee of somewhere around $4,500 as of last inquiry. To much money for any sane person. Talking with Bill at B & C, he would be willing to look at production of a non-clutch type unit. It would be light weight. With the light weight you would have the safety of housing breakage in case of kick-back. We have had in the past kick-back on the heavy starters on the high compression flat engines and the crankcase will crack first, not the starter housing. You either need a light starter housing or a clutch. The Clutch drives the price up. Until the supply and demand catch up to existing or non-existing stock, It will take considerable amount of effort on someone's part to move on this task. Any takers.

Jamie S. Treat

----- Original Message -----
From: james chybicki
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Starters

Hi!
There is a guy on Barnstormers selling the Jack and
Heintz JH6 Starter on Barnstormers. He indicates its a
replacement for the E-80. I have asked for FAA 337 of
other confirmation the interchangeablity....No
response. I emailed Jamie Treat, and he does not
think it is an approved alternate.
Has anyone else heard of the J&H-6
JIM
--- Thekortas@aol.com wrote:
> Hello John! Hope all is well!
> Further to the starter question...do you know if
> anyone has ever successfully gotten an approval for
> a more modern starter in lieu of the Eclipse? I am
> not aware of it. But, it sure seems like it might
> be a nice alternative to have something lighter and
> powerful that is more readily available. Just a
> question.
> Regards,
> Steve Korta
>

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'

John Berendt · Post by **John Berendt** » Wed Mar 12, 2003 6:26 pm

'Steve,

all is well made it through all the tests and exams ok. I do not know if
any one has ever received and approval for a model started on a Ranger. I
would take look at what is used on the new lycoming's and Contentials.too
bad we cannot use and alternator /Starter as they use on the LOM engines
John Berendt

----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Wednesday, March 12, 2003 11:28 AM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Starters

> Hello John! Hope all is well!
> Further to the starter question...do you know if anyone has ever
successfully gotten an approval for a more modern starter in lieu of the
Eclipse? I am not aware of it. But, it sure seems like it might be a nice
alternative to have something lighter and powerful that is more readily
available. Just a question.
> Regards,
> Steve Korta
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>

'