Fairchild Club Forum

Posted: **Fri Jun 13, 2003 9:44 pm**

'Trying to finish up a restoration on N77630 which is a 1946 24W 46 and have a few questions for any helpful club member.

!. What should the static RPM for a Curtiss Reed prop be for this 165 hp Warner?
2. The manual shows that the exhaust is open near the carburetor where the inner carb heat tube attaches to the carb heat box. What keeps very hot exaust from getting the carb. bowl to hot?
3. Lastly ,Is it common for the Curtis Reed prop the have some vibration between 12 -14 hundred RPM? It is smooth before and after that particular RPM setting. Thanks for any wisdom on these Q' s.

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Posted: **Fri Jun 13, 2003 10:17 pm**

'Charles Botts tried my Curtiss Reed on his Meyers OTW, and he said that the
maximum RPM that he saw at full throttle was around 1500 rpm. No vibrations
at any RPM was mentioned.
I do remember that there is two butterflies on the airflow for carb heat.
One is in the main cold air flow from the front of the motor(Normally open)
and the second (Normally closes) is located between the hot air blast tube
and the cold air chamber of the inlet. When you pull the carb heat on, the
large cold air butterfly starts to close and the hot air butterfly starts to
open. I seem to remember that the hot air is injected into the intake air
stream after it passes the large butterfly. Both the civilian and military
manual show the Cold/Hot air mixing box.

Bob

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom and Carol Burmeister"
To:
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 8:44 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

> Trying to finish up a restoration on N77630 which is a 1946 24W 46 and
have a few questions for any helpful club member.
>
> !. What should the static RPM for a Curtiss Reed prop be for this 165 hp
Warner?
> 2. The manual shows that the exhaust is open near the carburetor where
the inner carb heat tube attaches to the carb heat box. What keeps very hot
exaust from getting the carb. bowl to hot?
> 3. Lastly ,Is it common for the Curtis Reed prop the have some vibration
between 12 -14 hundred RPM? It is smooth before and after that particular
RPM setting. Thanks for any wisdom on these Q' s.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
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> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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>
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'

Posted: **Sat Jun 14, 2003 12:04 pm**

'Thanks Bob for the infromation.
I am getting 1750 RPM static with the Curtic reed now. I think that will be enough to do the trick.
You are right about the way the carb heat butterfly box works. The question I have is , Why is the exhaust open around the carb heat box with only the inner tube ( which is the carb heat tube ) connected to the carb heat butterfly box. This looks like the hot exhaust would be directed on to the carb float bowl area.

Robert Etter wrote:
Charles Botts tried my Curtiss Reed on his Meyers OTW, and he said that the
maximum RPM that he saw at full throttle was around 1500 rpm. No vibrations
at any RPM was mentioned.
I do remember that there is two butterflies on the airflow for carb heat.
One is in the main cold air flow from the front of the motor(Normally open)
and the second (Normally closes) is located between the hot air blast tube
and the cold air chamber of the inlet. When you pull the carb heat on, the
large cold air butterfly starts to close and the hot air butterfly starts to
open. I seem to remember that the hot air is injected into the intake air
stream after it passes the large butterfly. Both the civilian and military
manual show the Cold/Hot air mixing box.

Bob

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom and Carol Burmeister"
To:
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 8:44 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

> Trying to finish up a restoration on N77630 which is a 1946 24W 46 and
have a few questions for any helpful club member.
>
> !. What should the static RPM for a Curtiss Reed prop be for this 165 hp
Warner?
> 2. The manual shows that the exhaust is open near the carburetor where
the inner carb heat tube attaches to the carb heat box. What keeps very hot
exaust from getting the carb. bowl to hot?
> 3. Lastly ,Is it common for the Curtis Reed prop the have some vibration
between 12 -14 hundred RPM? It is smooth before and after that particular
RPM setting. Thanks for any wisdom on these Q' s.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
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> SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
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> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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>
>
>
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>
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'

Posted: **Sat Jun 14, 2003 12:30 pm**

'Tom,

Here are the specs from the TC.

Fixed pitch metal ... ... +22 lbs. (-51) +22 lbs.(-51)
(Curtiss Model 55518)
For landplanes only: Static rpm at maximum permissible throttle setting for diameters of not over 90
in., not under 87 in.: not over 1730, not under 1630. No additional tolerance permitted.
Static rpm at maximum permissible throttle setting for diameters not over 86 in.,
not under 83 in.: not over 1850, not under 1750. No additional tolerance permitted.

Tom Goodletts 24W41A with a Warner 165, static was 1800 rpm. Flat out 2150/2200.

All smooth at idle and above 1300 rpm. Some Warners have a rough spot in the 1100 rpm range. Contribute that to the induction system. The 185J I just flew is smooth at all settings. Tom Goodletts 165 Warner was rough enough that during taxi at 1100, you could not see the instruments mounted on the shock panel. I have brought this to the attention of John Duncan, will try to improve during manufacture someday.

Jamie

----- Original Message -----
From: Tom and Carol Burmeister
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2003 12:04 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

Thanks Bob for the infromation.
I am getting 1750 RPM static with the Curtic reed now. I think that will be enough to do the trick.
You are right about the way the carb heat butterfly box works. The question I have is , Why is the exhaust open around the carb heat box with only the inner tube ( which is the carb heat tube ) connected to the carb heat butterfly box. This looks like the hot exhaust would be directed on to the carb float bowl area.

Robert Etter wrote:
Charles Botts tried my Curtiss Reed on his Meyers OTW, and he said that the
maximum RPM that he saw at full throttle was around 1500 rpm. No vibrations
at any RPM was mentioned.
I do remember that there is two butterflies on the airflow for carb heat.
One is in the main cold air flow from the front of the motor(Normally open)
and the second (Normally closes) is located between the hot air blast tube
and the cold air chamber of the inlet. When you pull the carb heat on, the
large cold air butterfly starts to close and the hot air butterfly starts to
open. I seem to remember that the hot air is injected into the intake air
stream after it passes the large butterfly. Both the civilian and military
manual show the Cold/Hot air mixing box.

Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom and Carol Burmeister"
To:
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 8:44 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

> Trying to finish up a restoration on N77630 which is a 1946 24W 46 and
have a few questions for any helpful club member.
>
> !. What should the static RPM for a Curtiss Reed prop be for this 165 hp
Warner?
> 2. The manual shows that the exhaust is open near the carburetor where
the inner carb heat tube attaches to the carb heat box. What keeps very hot
exaust from getting the carb. bowl to hot?
> 3. Lastly ,Is it common for the Curtis Reed prop the have some vibration
between 12 -14 hundred RPM? It is smooth before and after that particular
RPM setting. Thanks for any wisdom on these Q' s.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
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'

Posted: **Sat Jun 14, 2003 9:20 pm**

'I remembered one thing that may save you some serious heartburn. After
working on an O.E. Warner/Fairchild crab. heat box, drop the filter out of
the filter box. With the aid of a mirror and a flashlight, verify the large
butterfly that is in the fresh air stream is in the fully open position with
the crab. heat off, and partially, to fully closed, when the carb. heat is
on.
The interconnect linkage in the mechanism will allow the butterfly to be
partially closed even with the crab. heat control in the fully off position.
With the price of fuel what it is, you don't need a motor that will run
really rich. It will look like you were running on 50% 100 Oct. and 50% Jet
A.
Bob

----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom and Carol Burmeister"
To:
Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2003 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

> Thanks Bob for the infromation.
> I am getting 1750 RPM static with the Curtic reed now. I think that will
be enough to do the trick.
> You are right about the way the carb heat butterfly box works. The
question I have is , Why is the exhaust open around the carb heat box with
only the inner tube ( which is the carb heat tube ) connected to the carb
heat butterfly box. This looks like the hot exhaust would be directed on to
the carb float bowl area.
>
> Robert Etter wrote:
> Charles Botts tried my Curtiss Reed on his Meyers OTW, and he said that
the
> maximum RPM that he saw at full throttle was around 1500 rpm. No
vibrations
> at any RPM was mentioned.
> I do remember that there is two butterflies on the airflow for carb heat.
> One is in the main cold air flow from the front of the motor(Normally
open)
> and the second (Normally closes) is located between the hot air blast tube
> and the cold air chamber of the inlet. When you pull the carb heat on,
the
> large cold air butterfly starts to close and the hot air butterfly starts
to
> open. I seem to remember that the hot air is injected into the intake air
> stream after it passes the large butterfly. Both the civilian and
military
> manual show the Cold/Hot air mixing box.
>
> Bob
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tom and Carol Burmeister"
> To:
> Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 8:44 PM
> Subject: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions
>
>
> > Trying to finish up a restoration on N77630 which is a 1946 24W 46 and
> have a few questions for any helpful club member.
> >
> > !. What should the static RPM for a Curtiss Reed prop be for this 165 hp
> Warner?
> > 2. The manual shows that the exhaust is open near the carburetor where
> the inner carb heat tube attaches to the carb heat box. What keeps very
hot
> exaust from getting the carb. bowl to hot?
> > 3. Lastly ,Is it common for the Curtis Reed prop the have some
vibration
> between 12 -14 hundred RPM? It is smooth before and after that particular
> RPM setting. Thanks for any wisdom on these Q' s.
> >
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> > fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
> >
> >
> >
> > Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups SponsorADVERTISEMENT
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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>
>
>
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>
>
> ---------------------------------
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>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
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>
>
>
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>
>
>

'

Posted: **Sat Jun 14, 2003 9:51 pm**

'Hi,

In case any of you have ever looked at the Warner 165 exhaust, the bottom
(which is next to the carb heat box) is closed off with the inner intensifier
tube running through the closure. No hot exhaust is directed toward the
carburetor.

As for the Curtiss Reed prop, the 55518 used on the 165-hp Warner spline
shaft can be pitched several different ways. Without knowing the pitch of the
prop there is no way you can determine what the RPM should be.

I have had an intermediate Curtiss Reed on my 24 which turns 1900 static.
One time I put a Curtiss Reed pitched for cruise and could only get 1650 static.
But the cruise prop added 15 mph to my cruise speed and a helleva long
distance to my takeoff run.

Earl W. Swaney
N28645

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]'

Posted: **Sun Jun 15, 2003 3:04 pm**

'Jamie, Thanks for the infromation. I believe that the Curtis reed prop that we have is the model 55111. This thing has a weihgt of about 44 lbs. Could the specs. be that far off on the actual weight ?

Jamie Treat wrote:Tom,

Here are the specs from the TC.

Fixed pitch metal ... ... +22 lbs. (-51) +22 lbs.(-51)
(Curtiss Model 55518)
For landplanes only: Static rpm at maximum permissible throttle setting for diameters of not over 90
in., not under 87 in.: not over 1730, not under 1630. No additional tolerance permitted.
Static rpm at maximum permissible throttle setting for diameters not over 86 in.,
not under 83 in.: not over 1850, not under 1750. No additional tolerance permitted.

Tom Goodletts 24W41A with a Warner 165, static was 1800 rpm. Flat out 2150/2200.

All smooth at idle and above 1300 rpm. Some Warners have a rough spot in the 1100 rpm range. Contribute that to the induction system. The 185J I just flew is smooth at all settings. Tom Goodletts 165 Warner was rough enough that during taxi at 1100, you could not see the instruments mounted on the shock panel. I have brought this to the attention of John Duncan, will try to improve during manufacture someday.

Jamie

----- Original Message -----
From: Tom and Carol Burmeister
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2003 12:04 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

Thanks Bob for the infromation.
I am getting 1750 RPM static with the Curtic reed now. I think that will be enough to do the trick.
You are right about the way the carb heat butterfly box works. The question I have is , Why is the exhaust open around the carb heat box with only the inner tube ( which is the carb heat tube ) connected to the carb heat butterfly box. This looks like the hot exhaust would be directed on to the carb float bowl area.

Robert Etter wrote:
Charles Botts tried my Curtiss Reed on his Meyers OTW, and he said that the
maximum RPM that he saw at full throttle was around 1500 rpm. No vibrations
at any RPM was mentioned.
I do remember that there is two butterflies on the airflow for carb heat.
One is in the main cold air flow from the front of the motor(Normally open)
and the second (Normally closes) is located between the hot air blast tube
and the cold air chamber of the inlet. When you pull the carb heat on, the
large cold air butterfly starts to close and the hot air butterfly starts to
open. I seem to remember that the hot air is injected into the intake air
stream after it passes the large butterfly. Both the civilian and military
manual show the Cold/Hot air mixing box.

Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom and Carol Burmeister"
To:
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 8:44 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

> Trying to finish up a restoration on N77630 which is a 1946 24W 46 and
have a few questions for any helpful club member.
>
> !. What should the static RPM for a Curtiss Reed prop be for this 165 hp
Warner?
> 2. The manual shows that the exhaust is open near the carburetor where
the inner carb heat tube attaches to the carb heat box. What keeps very hot
exaust from getting the carb. bowl to hot?
> 3. Lastly ,Is it common for the Curtis Reed prop the have some vibration
between 12 -14 hundred RPM? It is smooth before and after that particular
RPM setting. Thanks for any wisdom on these Q' s.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

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'

Posted: **Sun Jun 15, 2003 3:44 pm**

'Earl , Am I missing a piece of exhaust? There is a gap of approx. 1/2 inch all around the outside of this inter intensifier tube that connects to the carb heat box. This end of the exhaust is open and only about 3-4 inches from the carb fuel bowl. Seems like there should be some kind of flanged clamp to cover this 1/2 gap between the inner tube and the outer ex. pipe when it's that close to the carb float bowl.
Looking at the manual I have for the exhaust it shows that this ex. portion is open where the inner tube connect to the carb heat box.

In case any of you have ever looked at the Warner 165 exhaust, the bottom
(which is next to the carb heat box) is closed off with the inner intensifier
tube running through the closure. No hot exhaust is directed toward the
carburetor.

As for the Curtiss Reed prop, the 55518 used on the 165-hp Warner spline
shaft can be pitched several different ways. Without knowing the pitch of the
prop there is no way you can determine what the RPM should be.

I have had an intermediate Curtiss Reed on my 24 which turns 1900 static.
One time I put a Curtiss Reed pitched for cruise and could only get 1650 static.
But the cruise prop added 15 mph to my cruise speed and a helleva long
distance to my takeoff run.

Earl W. Swaney
N28645

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Posted: **Sun Jun 15, 2003 7:22 pm**

'Tom,

I don't think 22lbs for the Curtis is correct. No metal prop around is lighter than 35 lbs. I think the weight is wrong or a delta to the wood prop.

Jamie

----- Original Message -----
From: Tom and Carol Burmeister
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, June 15, 2003 3:03 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

Jamie, Thanks for the infromation. I believe that the Curtis reed prop that we have is the model 55111. This thing has a weihgt of about 44 lbs. Could the specs. be that far off on the actual weight ?

Jamie Treat wrote:Tom,

Here are the specs from the TC.

Fixed pitch metal ... ... +22 lbs. (-51) +22 lbs.(-51)
(Curtiss Model 55518)
For landplanes only: Static rpm at maximum permissible throttle setting for diameters of not over 90
in., not under 87 in.: not over 1730, not under 1630. No additional tolerance permitted.
Static rpm at maximum permissible throttle setting for diameters not over 86 in.,
not under 83 in.: not over 1850, not under 1750. No additional tolerance permitted.

Tom Goodletts 24W41A with a Warner 165, static was 1800 rpm. Flat out 2150/2200.

All smooth at idle and above 1300 rpm. Some Warners have a rough spot in the 1100 rpm range. Contribute that to the induction system. The 185J I just flew is smooth at all settings. Tom Goodletts 165 Warner was rough enough that during taxi at 1100, you could not see the instruments mounted on the shock panel. I have brought this to the attention of John Duncan, will try to improve during manufacture someday.

Jamie
----- Original Message -----
From: Tom and Carol Burmeister
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 14, 2003 12:04 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

Thanks Bob for the infromation.
I am getting 1750 RPM static with the Curtic reed now. I think that will be enough to do the trick.
You are right about the way the carb heat butterfly box works. The question I have is , Why is the exhaust open around the carb heat box with only the inner tube ( which is the carb heat tube ) connected to the carb heat butterfly box. This looks like the hot exhaust would be directed on to the carb float bowl area.

Robert Etter wrote:
Charles Botts tried my Curtiss Reed on his Meyers OTW, and he said that the
maximum RPM that he saw at full throttle was around 1500 rpm. No vibrations
at any RPM was mentioned.
I do remember that there is two butterflies on the airflow for carb heat.
One is in the main cold air flow from the front of the motor(Normally open)
and the second (Normally closes) is located between the hot air blast tube
and the cold air chamber of the inlet. When you pull the carb heat on, the
large cold air butterfly starts to close and the hot air butterfly starts to
open. I seem to remember that the hot air is injected into the intake air
stream after it passes the large butterfly. Both the civilian and military
manual show the Cold/Hot air mixing box.

Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tom and Carol Burmeister"
To:
Sent: Friday, June 13, 2003 8:44 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] 165 Warner and prop questions

> Trying to finish up a restoration on N77630 which is a 1946 24W 46 and
have a few questions for any helpful club member.
>
> !. What should the static RPM for a Curtiss Reed prop be for this 165 hp
Warner?
> 2. The manual shows that the exhaust is open near the carburetor where
the inner carb heat tube attaches to the carb heat box. What keeps very hot
exaust from getting the carb. bowl to hot?
> 3. Lastly ,Is it common for the Curtis Reed prop the have some vibration
between 12 -14 hundred RPM? It is smooth before and after that particular
RPM setting. Thanks for any wisdom on these Q' s.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> SBC Yahoo! DSL - Now only $29.95 per month!
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>

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'

Posted: **Sun Jun 15, 2003 7:38 pm**

'The "+22 lbs." refers to the additional weight over the specified
standard equipment prop.

:Dan Michael
:NC81323

On Sunday, June 15, 2003, at 04:03 PM, Tom and Carol Burmeister wrote:

> Jamie, Thanks for the infromation. I believe that the Curtis reed prop
> that we have is the model 55111. This thing has a weihgt of about 44
> lbs. Could the specs. be that far off on the actual weight ?
>
> Jamie Treat wrote:Tom,
>
> Here are the specs from the TC.
>
> Fixed pitch metal ... ... +22 lbs. (-51)
> +22 lbs.(-51)
> (Curtiss Model 55518)
> For landplanes only: Static rpm at maximum permissible throttle
> setting for diameters of not over 90
> in., not under 87 in.: not over 1730, not under 1630. No
> additional tolerance permitted.
> Static rpm at maximum permissible throttle setting for
> diameters not over 86 in.,
> not under 83 in.: not over 1850, not under 1750. No additional
> tolerance permitted.

'

Fairchild Club Forum

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions

Re: 165 Warner and prop questions