Fairchild Club Forum

Posted: **Thu May 29, 2003 2:15 pm**

'Hy everybody!

I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring an ex-warner powered F24.
But when he did encounter this plane it was powered by a Jacobs (235 HP??)

But as he would like to have the simpliest maintenance in the coming yars,
with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy jacobs, he would like to
try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat lycoming engine!!!!!

(I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but it is not my plane!!)

So do you know if anybody already tryied to implant a traditionnal lyco
under a warner prowered bonnet!??
(He still want to keep the original cowling, or at least the round nose, if
cowlings should be modified!)

Could anybody tell me about availability of the original warner (165HP)??
could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in exchange against a
warner??....what about difficulties of use and maintenance of a warner??

Or in the worst case, does anybody know the several types of conversions
ever made on F24??

(I really likde radial engines,...!)

Thank you for any informations!

Airy-H.MILLET

_________________________________________________________________
Téléchargez gratuitement MSN Messenger ! http://www.msn.fr/msger/default.asp'

Posted: **Thu May 29, 2003 8:12 pm**

'Airy-Hugues,

Plenty of 165 Warners around, but getting expensive. Here are his options that would make a respectable F-24. As for FLAT engine, tell him to go buy some Wichita Spam Can if he wants a flat engine. Don't ruin a good F-24

Warner 165
Warner 185
Cont 220 (too heavy, plenty of parts, two seat airplane with partial fuel)
Jake 245 (way to heavy, plenty of parts, single seat airplane with full fuel)
Ranger 175
Ranger 200
LOM 337 Inline (252HP Supercharged, Injected, 2000TBO) 37 lbs lighter than a Ranger. Engine approved in most countries except USA, working that issue.
LOM 300 Radial (Just a little heavier than the Warner)
Vedeneev M-14 260HP

Jamie S. Treat

----- Original Message -----
From: Airy-Hugues Millet
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 2:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Fairchild] engine conversions

Hy everybody!

I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring an ex-warner powered F24.
But when he did encounter this plane it was powered by a Jacobs (235 HP??)

But as he would like to have the simpliest maintenance in the coming yars,
with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy jacobs, he would like to
try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat lycoming engine!!!!!

(I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but it is not my plane!!)

So do you know if anybody already tryied to implant a traditionnal lyco
under a warner prowered bonnet!??
(He still want to keep the original cowling, or at least the round nose, if
cowlings should be modified!)

Could anybody tell me about availability of the original warner (165HP)??
could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in exchange against a
warner??....what about difficulties of use and maintenance of a warner??

Or in the worst case, does anybody know the several types of conversions
ever made on F24??

(I really likde radial engines,...!)

Thank you for any informations!

Airy-H.MILLET

_________________________________________________________________
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'

Posted: **Fri May 30, 2003 4:26 am**

'During WWII the Chinese government ordered a small number of Stearmans with
185 hp Lycomings flat engines and did not like them. The planes were later
converted to radial engine power plants. The flat Lycoming will turn a
smaller propeller and thus produce less thrust. Your friend will not be
satisfied with the conversion.
Grover

----- Original Message -----
From: "Airy-Hugues Millet"
To:
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 3:15 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] engine conversions

> Hy everybody!
>
> I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring an ex-warner powered
F24.
> But when he did encounter this plane it was powered by a Jacobs (235 HP??)
>
> But as he would like to have the simpliest maintenance in the coming yars,
> with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy jacobs, he would like
to
> try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat lycoming engine!!!!!
>
> (I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but it is not my plane!!)
>
> So do you know if anybody already tryied to implant a traditionnal lyco
> under a warner prowered bonnet!??
> (He still want to keep the original cowling, or at least the round nose,
if
> cowlings should be modified!)
>
> Could anybody tell me about availability of the original warner (165HP)??
> could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in exchange against a
> warner??....what about difficulties of use and maintenance of a warner??
>
> Or in the worst case, does anybody know the several types of conversions
> ever made on F24??
>
> (I really like radial engines,...!)
>
> Thank you for any informations!
>
> Airy-H.MILLET

'

Posted: **Fri May 30, 2003 4:50 am**

'What!!!????? An opposed engine on a Fairchild?!
Blasphemy!! . There are other considerations like
cooling, weight and balance and the installation
itself that have to be looked at. Getting approvals
would be a long drawn out, expensive process. If the
engine mount is removable, a Ranger installation is
simple and easy to get approved. At cruise, the
Ranger uses about 10gph which is not bad.

Mike

--- Jamie Treat wrote:

> Airy-Hugues,
>
> Plenty of 165 Warners around, but getting expensive.
> Here are his options that would make a respectable
> F-24. As for FLAT engine, tell him to go buy some
> Wichita Spam Can if he wants a flat engine. Don't
> ruin a good F-24
>
> Warner 165
> Warner 185
> Cont 220 (too heavy, plenty of parts, two seat
> airplane with partial fuel)
> Jake 245 (way to heavy, plenty of parts, single seat
> airplane with full fuel)
> Ranger 175
> Ranger 200
> LOM 337 Inline (252HP Supercharged, Injected,
> 2000TBO) 37 lbs lighter than a Ranger. Engine
> approved in most countries except USA, working that
> issue.
> LOM 300 Radial (Just a little heavier than the
> Warner)
> Vedeneev M-14 260HP
>
> Jamie S. Treat
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Airy-Hugues Millet
> To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 2:15 PM
> Subject: Re: [Fairchild] engine conversions
>
>
> Hy everybody!
>
> I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring
> an ex-warner powered F24.
> But when he did encounter this plane it was
> powered by a Jacobs (235 HP??)
>
> But as he would like to have the simpliest
> maintenance in the coming yars,
> with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy
> jacobs, he would like to
> try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat
> lycoming engine!!!!!
>
> (I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but
> it is not my plane!!)
>
> So do you know if anybody already tryied to
> implant a traditionnal lyco
> under a warner prowered bonnet!??
> (He still want to keep the original cowling, or at
> least the round nose, if
> cowlings should be modified!)
>
>
> Could anybody tell me about availability of the
> original warner (165HP)??
> could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in
> exchange against a
> warner??....what about difficulties of use and
> maintenance of a warner??
>
> Or in the worst case, does anybody know the
> several types of conversions
> ever made on F24??
>
> (I really likde radial engines,...!)
>
>
> Thank you for any informations!
>
> Airy-H.MILLET
>
>
>

_________________________________________________________________

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Posted: **Fri May 30, 2003 8:07 am**

'Airy,

During W.W.II the USA had Iowa air service install a flat Franklin Six in a
1940 F24. The aircraft was converted back to Ranger and in flying today.
it appears the Franklin did not work out. If the fellow can I suggest the
LOM engine.
John Berendt

----- Original Message -----
From: "Jamie Treat"
To:
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 9:12 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] engine conversions

Airy-Hugues,

Plenty of 165 Warners around, but getting expensive. Here are his options
that would make a respectable F-24. As for FLAT engine, tell him to go buy
some Wichita Spam Can if he wants a flat engine. Don't ruin a good F-24

Warner 165
Warner 185
Cont 220 (too heavy, plenty of parts, two seat airplane with partial fuel)
Jake 245 (way to heavy, plenty of parts, single seat airplane with full
fuel)
Ranger 175
Ranger 200
LOM 337 Inline (252HP Supercharged, Injected, 2000TBO) 37 lbs lighter than a
Ranger. Engine approved in most countries except USA, working that issue.
LOM 300 Radial (Just a little heavier than the Warner)
Vedeneev M-14 260HP

Jamie S. Treat

----- Original Message -----
From: Airy-Hugues Millet
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 2:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Fairchild] engine conversions

Hy everybody!

I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring an ex-warner powered
F24.
But when he did encounter this plane it was powered by a Jacobs (235 HP??)

But as he would like to have the simpliest maintenance in the coming yars,
with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy jacobs, he would like
to
try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat lycoming engine!!!!!

(I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but it is not my plane!!)

So do you know if anybody already tryied to implant a traditionnal lyco
under a warner prowered bonnet!??
(He still want to keep the original cowling, or at least the round nose,
if
cowlings should be modified!)

Could anybody tell me about availability of the original warner (165HP)??
could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in exchange against a
warner??....what about difficulties of use and maintenance of a warner??

Or in the worst case, does anybody know the several types of conversions
ever made on F24??

(I really likde radial engines,...!)

Thank you for any informations!

Airy-H.MILLET

_________________________________________________________________
Téléchargez gratuitement MSN Messenger !
http://www.msn.fr/msger/default.asp

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'

Posted: **Fri May 30, 2003 11:31 am**

'Jamie,

Thanks for the concise summary of engine conversion options. I wasn't
aware of the LOM radial. I went to the LOM web site

http://www.moraviation.com/

and found that the 315 hp engine weighs 480 lbs, a lot less than the
Continental but still 50% more than a Warner.

Also found on the LOM site that the factory has an overhauled 315hp that
they are selling for only $12,500. Wow. I don't need one now, but that
is quite affordable, and having an assured supply of parts would be a
comfort.

Are there any LOM radial powered Fairchilds flying?

Dan Casali
N2088 1937 24-G

Jamie Treat wrote:

>Airy-Hugues,
>
>Plenty of 165 Warners around, but getting expensive. Here are his options that would make a respectable F-24. As for FLAT engine, tell him to go buy some Wichita Spam Can if he wants a flat engine. Don't ruin a good F-24
>
>Warner 165
>Warner 185
>Cont 220 (too heavy, plenty of parts, two seat airplane with partial fuel)
>Jake 245 (way to heavy, plenty of parts, single seat airplane with full fuel)
>Ranger 175
>Ranger 200
>LOM 337 Inline (252HP Supercharged, Injected, 2000TBO) 37 lbs lighter than a Ranger. Engine approved in most countries except USA, working that issue.
>LOM 300 Radial (Just a little heavier than the Warner)
>Vedeneev M-14 260HP
>
>Jamie S. Treat
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Airy-Hugues Millet
> To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 2:15 PM
> Subject: Re: [Fairchild] engine conversions
>
>
> Hy everybody!
>
> I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring an ex-warner powered F24.
> But when he did encounter this plane it was powered by a Jacobs (235 HP??)
>
> But as he would like to have the simpliest maintenance in the coming yars,
> with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy jacobs, he would like to
> try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat lycoming engine!!!!!
>
> (I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but it is not my plane!!)
>
> So do you know if anybody already tryied to implant a traditionnal lyco
> under a warner prowered bonnet!??
> (He still want to keep the original cowling, or at least the round nose, if
> cowlings should be modified!)
>
>
> Could anybody tell me about availability of the original warner (165HP)??
> could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in exchange against a
> warner??....what about difficulties of use and maintenance of a warner??
>
> Or in the worst case, does anybody know the several types of conversions
> ever made on F24??
>
> (I really likde radial engines,...!)
>
>
> Thank you for any informations!
>
> Airy-H.MILLET
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Téléchargez gratuitement MSN Messenger ! http://www.msn.fr/msger/default.asp
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>

'

Posted: **Fri May 30, 2003 11:58 am**

'Dan,
To answer your question, no. Here's why. Add another
$25,000 to $30,000 for engineering, aggravation, FAA
foot shuffling and flight testing to that attractive
price of $12,500 for the engine and you will
understand why no one has installed this engine. It's
still cheaper (and easier!) to wrestle with the
approved engines. If I not mistaken, your G model's
engine mount is part of the fuselage. It would
require a complete redesign to absorb the stress and
added weight of the LOM. It's really not worth it.

Mike

--- Dan Casali wrote:

> Jamie,
>
> Thanks for the concise summary of engine conversion
> options. I wasn't
> aware of the LOM radial. I went to the LOM web site
>
> http://www.moraviation.com/
>
> and found that the 315 hp engine weighs 480 lbs, a
> lot less than the
> Continental but still 50% more than a Warner.
>
> Also found on the LOM site that the factory has an
> overhauled 315hp that
> they are selling for only $12,500. Wow. I don't
> need one now, but that
> is quite affordable, and having an assured supply of
> parts would be a
> comfort.
>
> Are there any LOM radial powered Fairchilds flying?
>
> Dan Casali
> N2088 1937 24-G

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Calendar - Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com'

Posted: **Fri May 30, 2003 2:13 pm**

'Hey Guys! Listen to Jamie, he has the problem covered.
Speaking of Jamie, He flew my 24 to Sun&Fun, but got a back row toward
the FlyMarket and
Didn?t get much exposure to buyers. It is for sale, NC
81236, Boston Maroon and Diana Cream. TTAF 2137 STOH 60, Jasco
Altinator, Sensenich
wood prop, Stainless exhaust, Terra 760 D Com, TN 200D Nav.
Tri-Nav OBS TRT 250 Transponder with Encoder, and AK450 ELT. Always
hangered,
Great investment at $75000. Bob Haas FT Myers FL. 239 694
2875

-----Original Message-----
From: Jamie Treat [mailto:jamietreat@direcway.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 10:12 PM
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] engine conversions

Airy-Hugues,

Plenty of 165 Warners around, but getting expensive. Here are his
options that would make a respectable F-24. As for FLAT engine, tell him
to go buy some Wichita Spam Can if he wants a flat engine. Don't ruin a
good F-24

Warner 165
Warner 185
Cont 220 (too heavy, plenty of parts, two seat airplane with partial
fuel)
Jake 245 (way to heavy, plenty of parts, single seat airplane with full
fuel)
Ranger 175
Ranger 200
LOM 337 Inline (252HP Supercharged, Injected, 2000TBO) 37 lbs lighter
than a Ranger. Engine approved in most countries except USA, working
that issue.
LOM 300 Radial (Just a little heavier than the Warner)
Vedeneev M-14 260HP

Jamie S. Treat

----- Original Message -----
From: Airy-Hugues Millet
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 2:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Fairchild] engine conversions

Hy everybody!

I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring an ex-warner
powered F24.
But when he did encounter this plane it was powered by a Jacobs (235
HP??)

But as he would like to have the simpliest maintenance in the coming
yars,
with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy jacobs, he would
like to
try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat lycoming engine!!!!!

(I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but it is not my
plane!!)

So do you know if anybody already tryied to implant a traditionnal
lyco
under a warner prowered bonnet!??
(He still want to keep the original cowling, or at least the round
nose, if
cowlings should be modified!)

Could anybody tell me about availability of the original warner
(165HP)??
could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in exchange against a
warner??....what about difficulties of use and maintenance of a
warner??

Or in the worst case, does anybody know the several types of
conversions
ever made on F24??

(I really likde radial engines,...!)

Thank you for any informations!

Airy-H.MILLET

_________________________________________________________________
Téléchargez gratuitement MSN Messenger !
http://www.msn.fr/msger/default.asp

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'

Posted: **Fri May 30, 2003 2:24 pm**

'Dan,

Not that I know of. I had a M14P (400hp) on the front of my Single Seat Pitts type Bi-Plane. Sold it to Kevin Kimball for a Model 12 customer. I will be going back to a 360hp Lyc 540.

Jamie

----- Original Message -----
From: Dan Casali
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] engine conversions

Jamie,

Thanks for the concise summary of engine conversion options. I wasn't
aware of the LOM radial. I went to the LOM web site

http://www.moraviation.com/

and found that the 315 hp engine weighs 480 lbs, a lot less than the
Continental but still 50% more than a Warner.

Also found on the LOM site that the factory has an overhauled 315hp that
they are selling for only $12,500. Wow. I don't need one now, but that
is quite affordable, and having an assured supply of parts would be a
comfort.

Are there any LOM radial powered Fairchilds flying?

Dan Casali
N2088 1937 24-G

Jamie Treat wrote:

>Airy-Hugues,
>
>Plenty of 165 Warners around, but getting expensive. Here are his options that would make a respectable F-24. As for FLAT engine, tell him to go buy some Wichita Spam Can if he wants a flat engine. Don't ruin a good F-24
>
>Warner 165
>Warner 185
>Cont 220 (too heavy, plenty of parts, two seat airplane with partial fuel)
>Jake 245 (way to heavy, plenty of parts, single seat airplane with full fuel)
>Ranger 175
>Ranger 200
>LOM 337 Inline (252HP Supercharged, Injected, 2000TBO) 37 lbs lighter than a Ranger. Engine approved in most countries except USA, working that issue.
>LOM 300 Radial (Just a little heavier than the Warner)
>Vedeneev M-14 260HP
>
>Jamie S. Treat
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Airy-Hugues Millet
> To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
> Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 2:15 PM
> Subject: Re: [Fairchild] engine conversions
>
>
> Hy everybody!
>
> I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring an ex-warner powered F24.
> But when he did encounter this plane it was powered by a Jacobs (235 HP??)
>
> But as he would like to have the simpliest maintenance in the coming yars,
> with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy jacobs, he would like to
> try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat lycoming engine!!!!!
>
> (I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but it is not my plane!!)
>
> So do you know if anybody already tryied to implant a traditionnal lyco
> under a warner prowered bonnet!??
> (He still want to keep the original cowling, or at least the round nose, if
> cowlings should be modified!)
>
>
> Could anybody tell me about availability of the original warner (165HP)??
> could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in exchange against a
> warner??....what about difficulties of use and maintenance of a warner??
>
> Or in the worst case, does anybody know the several types of conversions
> ever made on F24??
>
> (I really likde radial engines,...!)
>
>
> Thank you for any informations!
>
> Airy-H.MILLET
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Téléchargez gratuitement MSN Messenger ! http://www.msn.fr/msger/default.asp
>
>
> Yahoo! Groups Sponsor
>
>
>
> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
> fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to the Yahoo! Terms of Service.
>
>
>
>[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
>To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
>fairchildclub-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com
>
>
>
>Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
>
>
>
>
>

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'

Posted: **Fri May 30, 2003 5:11 pm**

'All,

Bob Haas's F-24 is a pretty one, within the top five Ranger powered in the country. Hate to see him sell, will miss my ride to Sun-N-Fun. Nothing like going first class. Absolute joy to fly. Needs nothing but repeated application of Avgas.

Jamie S. Treat

----- Original Message -----
From: Bob Haas
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Friday, May 30, 2003 2:12 PM
Subject: RE: [fairchildclub] engine conversions

Hey Guys! Listen to Jamie, he has the problem covered.
Speaking of Jamie, He flew my 24 to Sun&Fun, but got a back row toward
the FlyMarket and
Didn't get much exposure to buyers. It is for sale, NC
81236, Boston Maroon and Diana Cream. TTAF 2137 STOH 60, Jasco
Altinator, Sensenich
wood prop, Stainless exhaust, Terra 760 D Com, TN 200D Nav.
Tri-Nav OBS TRT 250 Transponder with Encoder, and AK450 ELT. Always
hangered,
Great investment at $75000. Bob Haas FT Myers FL. 239 694
2875

-----Original Message-----
From: Jamie Treat [mailto:jamietreat@direcway.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 10:12 PM
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] engine conversions

Airy-Hugues,

Plenty of 165 Warners around, but getting expensive. Here are his
options that would make a respectable F-24. As for FLAT engine, tell him
to go buy some Wichita Spam Can if he wants a flat engine. Don't ruin a
good F-24

Warner 165
Warner 185
Cont 220 (too heavy, plenty of parts, two seat airplane with partial
fuel)
Jake 245 (way to heavy, plenty of parts, single seat airplane with full
fuel)
Ranger 175
Ranger 200
LOM 337 Inline (252HP Supercharged, Injected, 2000TBO) 37 lbs lighter
than a Ranger. Engine approved in most countries except USA, working
that issue.
LOM 300 Radial (Just a little heavier than the Warner)
Vedeneev M-14 260HP

Jamie S. Treat

----- Original Message -----
From: Airy-Hugues Millet
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Thursday, May 29, 2003 2:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Fairchild] engine conversions

Hy everybody!

I just met yesterday a french guy who is restoring an ex-warner
powered F24.
But when he did encounter this plane it was powered by a Jacobs (235
HP??)

But as he would like to have the simpliest maintenance in the coming
yars,
with less fuel consumption as with a big and heavy jacobs, he would
like to
try to convert his plane with a 180HP/200HP flat lycoming engine!!!!!

(I personnally don't think it is a good idea...but it is not my
plane!!)

So do you know if anybody already tryied to implant a traditionnal
lyco
under a warner prowered bonnet!??
(He still want to keep the original cowling, or at least the round
nose, if
cowlings should be modified!)

Could anybody tell me about availability of the original warner
(165HP)??
could it be an idea to put the jacobs engine in exchange against a
warner??....what about difficulties of use and maintenance of a
warner??

Or in the worst case, does anybody know the several types of
conversions
ever made on F24??

(I really likde radial engines,...!)

Thank you for any informations!

Airy-H.MILLET

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