Re: Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

John Ellis · Post by **John Ellis** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 3:32 pm

'Hi to all,

The plugs that go into the crankshaft all leak. I have tried just about everything, including making new plugs oversize, freezing the plugs and heating the shaft for the installation.

This worked for about 200 hours.

I have lowered the oil pressure to 35 lbs, used all types of sealer and still get leaks. Oil consumption went from about a pint per hour to 1 1/2 quarts per hour the last couple of times it flew. I feel sure a plug turned loose again.

Does anyone have a fix that works?

Thanks,

John Ellis a/p

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]'

Curt Kinchen · Post by **Curt Kinchen** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:24 pm

'I had an engine where the plugs were machined for o-rings. They were tight, and I'm pretty sure they didn't
leak much if anything. Engine still used between 1 and 1.25 qts/hour. If it doesn't get any worse than where you are right now I wouldn't worry about it. Curt Kinchen

To: fchld@bevcomm.net; fairchildclub@yahoogroups.comFrom: johnee35@att.netDate: Sat, 21 Jun 2008 16:36:02 -0500Subject: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Hi to all,The plugs that go into the crankshaft all leak. I have tried just about everything, including making new plugs oversize, freezing the plugs and heating the shaft for the installation.This worked for about 200 hours.I have lowered the oil pressure to 35 lbs, used all types of sealer and still get leaks. Oil consumption went from about a pint per hour to 1 1/2 quarts per hour the last couple of times it flew. I feel sure a plug turned loose again.Does anyone have a fix that works?Thanks,John Ellis a/p[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]'

WILLIAM SPRIGGS · Post by **WILLIAM SPRIGGS** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 8:53 am

'Hi John: I had the same problem with leaking plugs, but talking to the late Ike Fernandes obtained the fixture to machine the groves in the plugs to insert o-rings. It's a tight job to get the plugs back into the crank with the o-rings installed, but I think this will cure the problem. Let me know if you would like a set of machined plugs. Bill Spriggs waspriggs@msn.com

----- Original Message -----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchild club ; fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2008 2:36 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Hi to all,

The plugs that go into the crankshaft all leak. I have tried just about everything, including making new plugs oversize, freezing the plugs and heating the shaft for the installation.

This worked for about 200 hours.

I have lowered the oil pressure to 35 lbs, used all types of sealer and still get leaks. Oil consumption went from about a pint per hour to 1 1/2 quarts per hour the last couple of times it flew. I feel sure a plug turned loose again.

Does anyone have a fix that works?

Thanks,

John Ellis a/p

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

'

Michael Denest · Post by **Michael Denest** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 6:02 pm

'Clean the mating surfaces and apply red Locktite. How many hours on the engine? Your engine should be running at least 60# at power, 35 is way too low.

Mike

Quando omni flunkus moritati
(If all else fails, play dead)
- "Red" Green

----- Original Message ----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchild club ; fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:36:02 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Hi to all,

The plugs that go into the crankshaft all leak. I have tried just about everything, including making new plugs oversize, freezing the plugs and heating the shaft for the installation.

This worked for about 200 hours.

I have lowered the oil pressure to 35 lbs, used all types of sealer and still get leaks. Oil consumption went from about a pint per hour to 1 1/2 quarts per hour the last couple of times it flew. I feel sure a plug turned loose again.

Does anyone have a fix that works?

Thanks,

John Ellis a/p

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]'

John Ellis · Post by **John Ellis** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 6:58 pm

'Mike,

Rebuilt the engine 140 hours ago. re-poured all the bearings, line bored mains to fit shaft with .0025 clearance, cut rod bearings same clearance.

At 35 pounds or 60 pounds, your still have only the oil in the clearance area to protect shaft and bearings. The more pressure, the more oil goes throught same space to be controlled by the rings.

I used Locktite # 603 to seal the plugs. Worked very well until a few flights back, consumption went to 1 1/2 quarts per hour from quart every 2 1/2 hours. Lowest compression is 74/80, with engine running good.

I called Locktite when doing the overhaul, they recommended the # 603. What number are you using?

Thanks,

John

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Denest
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2008 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Clean the mating surfaces and apply red Locktite. How many hours on the engine? Your engine should be running at least 60# at power, 35 is way too low.

Mike

Quando omni flunkus moritati
(If all else fails, play dead)
- "Red" Green

----- Original Message ----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchild club ; fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:36:02 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Hi to all,

The plugs that go into the crankshaft all leak. I have tried just about everything, including making new plugs oversize, freezing the plugs and heating the shaft for the installation.

This worked for about 200 hours.

I have lowered the oil pressure to 35 lbs, used all types of sealer and still get leaks. Oil consumption went from about a pint per hour to 1 1/2 quarts per hour the last couple of times it flew. I feel sure a plug turned loose again.

Does anyone have a fix that works?

Thanks,

John Ellis a/p

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

'

Michael Denest · Post by **Michael Denest** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 5:45 am

'I believe we're using the same Locktite. Let me ask you this question. What are your cylinder dimensions and what is the ring end gap fit and are the cylinders chromed? Personally, I think that 1 1/2 qts/hour is pretty darn good.
Rangers were originally designed to run sloppy using 60wt. mineral oil, thus the .004" to .005" clearance on the main bearings. Sometimes trying to make this engine operate like a flat engine regarding oil consumption is pure futility.

Mike

Quando omni flunkus moritati
(If all else fails, play dead)
- "Red" Green

----- Original Message ----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2008 9:00:33 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Mike,

Rebuilt the engine 140 hours ago. re-poured all the bearings, line bored mains to fit shaft with .0025 clearance, cut rod bearings same clearance.

At 35 pounds or 60 pounds, your still have only the oil in the clearance area to protect shaft and bearings. The more pressure, the more oil goes throught same space to be controlled by the rings.

I used Locktite # 603 to seal the plugs. Worked very well until a few flights back, consumption went to 1 1/2 quarts per hour from quart every 2 1/2 hours. Lowest compression is 74/80, with engine running good.

I called Locktite when doing the overhaul, they recommended the # 603. What number are you using?

Thanks,

John

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Denest
To: fairchildclub@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2008 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Clean the mating surfaces and apply red Locktite. How many hours on the engine? Your engine should be running at least 60# at power, 35 is way too low.

Mike

Quando omni flunkus moritati
(If all else fails, play dead)
- "Red" Green

----- Original Message ----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchild club ; fairchildclub@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:36:02 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Hi to all,

The plugs that go into the crankshaft all leak. I have tried just about everything, including making new plugs oversize, freezing the plugs and heating the shaft for the installation.

This worked for about 200 hours.

I have lowered the oil pressure to 35 lbs, used all types of sealer and still get leaks. Oil consumption went from about a pint per hour to 1 1/2 quarts per hour the last couple of times it flew. I feel sure a plug turned loose again.

Does anyone have a fix that works?

Thanks,

John Ellis a/p

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

'

John Ellis · Post by **John Ellis** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 8:05 am

'Hi Mike,

The rings and cylinders are not the problem with Ranger oil consumption, it is the quanity of oil to be controlled.

If you can imagine quantity of oil going through bearing with .004 clearance, plus leakage from the crank at 60 pounds pressure. This could easily be 1/2 gallon per minute or more.

Now look at the pistons, they all have a 1/8 inch hole on each side to enable piston pin clip removal. The total of these holes is 1 1/2 inch hole by-passing the oil rings completely.

The engines i have running all use around 1 quart every 2 - 3 hours untill one of those damn plugs start to leak bad.

Give me a call and I can fill in more details..

John

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Denest
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, June 23, 2008 6:45 AM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

I believe we're using the same Locktite. Let me ask you this question. What are your cylinder dimensions and what is the ring end gap fit and are the cylinders chromed? Personally, I think that 1 1/2 qts/hour is pretty darn good.
Rangers were originally designed to run sloppy using 60wt. mineral oil, thus the .004" to .005" clearance on the main bearings. Sometimes trying to make this engine operate like a flat engine regarding oil consumption is pure futility.

Mike

Quando omni flunkus moritati
(If all else fails, play dead)
- "Red" Green

----- Original Message ----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2008 9:00:33 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Mike,

Rebuilt the engine 140 hours ago. re-poured all the bearings, line bored mains to fit shaft with .0025 clearance, cut rod bearings same clearance.

At 35 pounds or 60 pounds, your still have only the oil in the clearance area to protect shaft and bearings. The more pressure, the more oil goes throught same space to be controlled by the rings.

I used Locktite # 603 to seal the plugs. Worked very well until a few flights back, consumption went to 1 1/2 quarts per hour from quart every 2 1/2 hours. Lowest compression is 74/80, with engine running good.

I called Locktite when doing the overhaul, they recommended the # 603. What number are you using?

Thanks,

John

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Denest
To: fairchildclub@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2008 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Clean the mating surfaces and apply red Locktite. How many hours on the engine? Your engine should be running at least 60# at power, 35 is way too low.

Mike

Quando omni flunkus moritati
(If all else fails, play dead)
- "Red" Green

----- Original Message ----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchild club ; fairchildclub@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:36:02 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Hi to all,

The plugs that go into the crankshaft all leak. I have tried just about everything, including making new plugs oversize, freezing the plugs and heating the shaft for the installation.

This worked for about 200 hours.

I have lowered the oil pressure to 35 lbs, used all types of sealer and still get leaks. Oil consumption went from about a pint per hour to 1 1/2 quarts per hour the last couple of times it flew. I feel sure a plug turned loose again.

Does anyone have a fix that works?

Thanks,

John Ellis a/p

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

'

John Ellis · Post by **John Ellis** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 9:07 am

'Mike,

Sorry, failed to give my phone # 573 450 1676.

John

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]'

Bob Haas · Post by **Bob Haas** » Mon Jun 23, 2008 6:53 pm

'I concur with Mike, if you can stay in the air and cover ground
with that kind of oil consumption, that's

Not bad. When you start hopping rides and do wifferdills that when you dip
the stick often. Bob Haas.

_____

From: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com]
On Behalf Of John Ellis
Sent: Monday, June 23, 2008 10:09 AM
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Hi Mike,

The rings and cylinders are not the problem with Ranger oil consumption, it
is the quanity of oil to be controlled.

If you can imagine quantity of oil going through bearing with .004
clearance, plus leakage from the crank at 60 pounds pressure. This could
easily be 1/2 gallon per minute or more.

Now look at the pistons, they all have a 1/8 inch hole on each side to
enable piston pin clip removal. The total of these holes is 1 1/2 inch hole
by-passing the oil rings completely.

The engines i have running all use around 1 quart every 2 - 3 hours untill
one of those damn plugs start to leak bad.

Give me a call and I can fill in more details..

John

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Denest
To: fairchildclub@ yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, June 23, 2008 6:45 AM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

I believe we're using the same Locktite. Let me ask you this question. What
are your cylinder dimensions and what is the ring end gap fit and are the
cylinders chromed? Personally, I think that 1 1/2 qts/hour is pretty darn
good.
Rangers were originally designed to run sloppy using 60wt. mineral oil, thus
the .004" to .005" clearance on the main bearings. Sometimes trying to make
this engine operate like a flat engine regarding oil consumption is pure
futility.

Mike

Quando omni flunkus moritati
(If all else fails, play dead)
- "Red" Green

----- Original Message ----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchildclub@ yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2008 9:00:33 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Mike,

Rebuilt the engine 140 hours ago. re-poured all the bearings, line bored
mains to fit shaft with .0025 clearance, cut rod bearings same clearance.

At 35 pounds or 60 pounds, your still have only the oil in the clearance
area to protect shaft and bearings. The more pressure, the more oil goes
throught same space to be controlled by the rings.

I used Locktite # 603 to seal the plugs. Worked very well until a few
flights back, consumption went to 1 1/2 quarts per hour from quart every 2
1/2 hours. Lowest compression is 74/80, with engine running good.

I called Locktite when doing the overhaul, they recommended the # 603. What
number are you using?

Thanks,

John

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Denest
To: fairchildclub@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Sunday, June 22, 2008 7:02 PM
Subject: Re: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Clean the mating surfaces and apply red Locktite. How many hours on the
engine? Your engine should be running at least 60# at power, 35 is way too
low.

Mike

Quando omni flunkus moritati
(If all else fails, play dead)
- "Red" Green

----- Original Message ----
From: John Ellis
To: fairchild club ; fairchildclub@ yahoogroups. com
Sent: Saturday, June 21, 2008 5:36:02 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Ranger engine crankshaft oil gally plugs.

Hi to all,

The plugs that go into the crankshaft all leak. I have tried just about
everything, including making new plugs oversize, freezing the plugs and
heating the shaft for the installation.

This worked for about 200 hours.

I have lowered the oil pressure to 35 lbs, used all types of sealer and
still get leaks. Oil consumption went from about a pint per hour to 1 1/2
quarts per hour the last couple of times it flew. I feel sure a plug turned
loose again.

Does anyone have a fix that works?

Thanks,

John Ellis a/p

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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'