'Hi Fairchild club
Not to start a great big depate, but Bob and I are
ready to cover our UC-61K Fuselage!!!!
What's better a envelope or sheets?
We are leaning toward the Poly Fiber application
process, It appears to be the most user friendly.
Is there any critical area's that a club memeber has
found through restoring a F24 or old school knowledge?
Any information and or guidance will be greatful!
Thanks
Keep 'Em Flying
Jim Chybicki / Bob Coon
UC-61K 43-14964 N24FM
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com'
Re: Covering our Baby
-
rangerrobertmn
- Posts: 66
- Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2004 6:00 pm
Re: Covering our Baby
'Jim,
I used a fuselage envelope that is now sold by Aircraft Spruce. I
had them make it for my 24K (the first of the four place 24s). I
think they have one for 1937 and earlier, and one for 1938 and
later. The only issue, is to shrink the fabric such that the seams
line up with the longerons. I don't think that sheets would be much
harder, but may require a bit more material. I would get medium-to-
heavy fabric for the fuselage, and medium fabric for the wings and
rudder and elevator, and light fabric to cover the horizontal and
vertical (plywood covered) tail surfaces.
I used an envelope for the wings 'cause I wanted to 'pad' the
leading edge with Poly Fiber Batting. You cannot make a glue seam
over the batting. If you intend to glue the fabric to the leading
edge, then you could use sheet material instead.
I am covering a Kitfox wing this week, and violated one of my
personal rules that I tell everyone to follow. Just before you are
ready to apply the covering, spend an additional two hours with the
assistance of a two armed helper, and stretch a piece of shrink-wrap
or some other shiny material, over every part of the structure you
are about to cover. You should look for things that 'stick up'.
Glue blobs, mis-shaped ribs, poor fitting formers, ANYTHING. Now
decide what to do about it, cause once the cover is on, these things
will stick out.
My second personal rule is "Don't ever even begin to imagine, that
the next step will cover up any little imperfection". Each step
will make it worse. Don't go onto the next step in the process
until you have this step completed as well as you can get it.
The good news is that the Poly Fiber process will result in a
beautiful finish and it is easy to do. If you want a 'wet' finish,
you can use the Aerothane products. If you want a more original
finish, you can use the Polytone products. Both are non-flammable
to the extent that they will not support combustion (remove the
flame and they will stop burning).
Most people don't do it, but you can make the Polytone finish look
like the had rubbed finish of some of the older luxury airplanes.
You need to sand a little more aggressively and use finer sandpaper,
but the results are crowd-pleasing. I finished my last airplane (J-
3 Cub on floats) with 900 grit before the first color coat, and 1200
grit before the last color coat, and 2400 grit two weeks after it
was painted.
My most important tip for painting, is to purchase a 'flip chart'
from the local office products store. Hang that flip-chart in your
paint booth. EVERY time you are about to start spraying something,
ALWAYS spray that flip-chart first. Look closely at the spray
pattern and coverage. Make adjustment at the flip-chart, NOT on
your nice airplane. I even test spray after I re-fill the paint gun.
Good Luck
Bob Waldron
Stillwater, MN
1939 Fairchild 24K
www.cpinternet.com/~rWaldron/
--- In fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com, james chybicki
wrote:
I used a fuselage envelope that is now sold by Aircraft Spruce. I
had them make it for my 24K (the first of the four place 24s). I
think they have one for 1937 and earlier, and one for 1938 and
later. The only issue, is to shrink the fabric such that the seams
line up with the longerons. I don't think that sheets would be much
harder, but may require a bit more material. I would get medium-to-
heavy fabric for the fuselage, and medium fabric for the wings and
rudder and elevator, and light fabric to cover the horizontal and
vertical (plywood covered) tail surfaces.
I used an envelope for the wings 'cause I wanted to 'pad' the
leading edge with Poly Fiber Batting. You cannot make a glue seam
over the batting. If you intend to glue the fabric to the leading
edge, then you could use sheet material instead.
I am covering a Kitfox wing this week, and violated one of my
personal rules that I tell everyone to follow. Just before you are
ready to apply the covering, spend an additional two hours with the
assistance of a two armed helper, and stretch a piece of shrink-wrap
or some other shiny material, over every part of the structure you
are about to cover. You should look for things that 'stick up'.
Glue blobs, mis-shaped ribs, poor fitting formers, ANYTHING. Now
decide what to do about it, cause once the cover is on, these things
will stick out.
My second personal rule is "Don't ever even begin to imagine, that
the next step will cover up any little imperfection". Each step
will make it worse. Don't go onto the next step in the process
until you have this step completed as well as you can get it.
The good news is that the Poly Fiber process will result in a
beautiful finish and it is easy to do. If you want a 'wet' finish,
you can use the Aerothane products. If you want a more original
finish, you can use the Polytone products. Both are non-flammable
to the extent that they will not support combustion (remove the
flame and they will stop burning).
Most people don't do it, but you can make the Polytone finish look
like the had rubbed finish of some of the older luxury airplanes.
You need to sand a little more aggressively and use finer sandpaper,
but the results are crowd-pleasing. I finished my last airplane (J-
3 Cub on floats) with 900 grit before the first color coat, and 1200
grit before the last color coat, and 2400 grit two weeks after it
was painted.
My most important tip for painting, is to purchase a 'flip chart'
from the local office products store. Hang that flip-chart in your
paint booth. EVERY time you are about to start spraying something,
ALWAYS spray that flip-chart first. Look closely at the spray
pattern and coverage. Make adjustment at the flip-chart, NOT on
your nice airplane. I even test spray after I re-fill the paint gun.
Good Luck
Bob Waldron
Stillwater, MN
1939 Fairchild 24K
www.cpinternet.com/~rWaldron/
--- In fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com, james chybicki
wrote:
'>
> Hi Fairchild club
>
> Not to start a great big depate, but Bob and I are
> ready to cover our UC-61K Fuselage!!!!
> What's better a envelope or sheets?
> We are leaning toward the Poly Fiber application
> process, It appears to be the most user friendly.
> Is there any critical area's that a club memeber has
> found through restoring a F24 or old school knowledge?
> Any information and or guidance will be greatful!
>
> Thanks
> Keep 'Em Flying
> Jim Chybicki / Bob Coon
> UC-61K 43-14964 N24FM
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
-
Jay Thomson
- Posts: 23
- Joined: Sun Apr 02, 2006 4:13 pm
Re: Covering our Baby
'Jim;
I have been using Poly Fiber for years and have covered a lot of airplanes. If you want to have a real MESS, use an envelope. I strongly advise you to use the fabric off the roll, and although it is easy to apply, get some help for the job. I would cover the control surfaces first, then the wings and the fuselage last. What makes a cover job look nice is the way the tapes are applied. If they aren't straight it's going to look bad. Even though I have done a lot of covering, I learn something new every time I do it. The previous advise is very good, except I would use medium weight fabric on the fuselage because the weave is tighter and looks nicer than the heavy weight. Also, if you ever have to patch something and you have to order a new can of Poly Tone or Aerothane, don't count on it to match what is already on the plane because it wont. Buy all the paint that you are going to use at the same time so that it will be from the same batch. I would use Poly Tone
on the fabric and Aerothane with flatner on all the metal. Anything I can help you with, let me know. Jay NC81285
james chybicki wrote:
Hi Fairchild club
Not to start a great big depate, but Bob and I are
ready to cover our UC-61K Fuselage!!!!
What's better a envelope or sheets?
We are leaning toward the Poly Fiber application
process, It appears to be the most user friendly.
Is there any critical area's that a club memeber has
found through restoring a F24 or old school knowledge?
Any information and or guidance will be greatful!
Thanks
Keep 'Em Flying
Jim Chybicki / Bob Coon
UC-61K 43-14964 N24FM
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]'
I have been using Poly Fiber for years and have covered a lot of airplanes. If you want to have a real MESS, use an envelope. I strongly advise you to use the fabric off the roll, and although it is easy to apply, get some help for the job. I would cover the control surfaces first, then the wings and the fuselage last. What makes a cover job look nice is the way the tapes are applied. If they aren't straight it's going to look bad. Even though I have done a lot of covering, I learn something new every time I do it. The previous advise is very good, except I would use medium weight fabric on the fuselage because the weave is tighter and looks nicer than the heavy weight. Also, if you ever have to patch something and you have to order a new can of Poly Tone or Aerothane, don't count on it to match what is already on the plane because it wont. Buy all the paint that you are going to use at the same time so that it will be from the same batch. I would use Poly Tone
on the fabric and Aerothane with flatner on all the metal. Anything I can help you with, let me know. Jay NC81285
james chybicki wrote:
Hi Fairchild club
Not to start a great big depate, but Bob and I are
ready to cover our UC-61K Fuselage!!!!
What's better a envelope or sheets?
We are leaning toward the Poly Fiber application
process, It appears to be the most user friendly.
Is there any critical area's that a club memeber has
found through restoring a F24 or old school knowledge?
Any information and or guidance will be greatful!
Thanks
Keep 'Em Flying
Jim Chybicki / Bob Coon
UC-61K 43-14964 N24FM
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
---------------------------------
Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell?
Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos.
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]'
-
Tom Downey
- Posts: 216
- Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2001 11:28 pm
Re: Covering our Baby
'--- In fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com, james chybicki
wrote:
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/cs/index.html
And refinishing supplies from -->
http://www.stewartshangar21.com/
This is the newest system on the market, but still, it has been
around a few years. Its big claim to fame is it does not stink, and
it shipps with out hazmat charges.
See the write up on the page. It's great stuff, and is much easier
to apply, giving you a better chance of getting the trophy winning
finish.'
wrote:
I use envelops from --->>
> Hi Fairchild club
>
> Not to start a great big depate, but Bob and I are
> ready to cover our UC-61K Fuselage!!!!
> What's better a envelope or sheets?
> We are leaning toward the Poly Fiber application
> process, It appears to be the most user friendly.
> Is there any critical area's that a club memeber has
> found through restoring a F24 or old school knowledge?
> Any information and or guidance will be greatful!
>
> Thanks
> Keep 'Em Flying
> Jim Chybicki / Bob Coon
> UC-61K 43-14964 N24FM
http://www.aircraftspruce.com/menus/cs/index.html
And refinishing supplies from -->
http://www.stewartshangar21.com/
This is the newest system on the market, but still, it has been
around a few years. Its big claim to fame is it does not stink, and
it shipps with out hazmat charges.
See the write up on the page. It's great stuff, and is much easier
to apply, giving you a better chance of getting the trophy winning
finish.'
-
Buell Powell
- Posts: 111
- Joined: Thu Sep 20, 2001 8:19 am
Re: Covering our Baby
'Hi Jim,
I have used Poly Fiber for several projects and have had really
good luck with it. The first plane I used it on was my Taylorcraft in
1991 and it still looks about like it did when I first covered it. I
have covered both with envelopes and sheets and have found that the
envelopes from Aircraft Spruce work really well especially on wings
because you don't end up with the fabric overlapping on the leading and
trailing edges which take some extra painting and sanding to get rid
of. On the horizontal stabilizers and elevators you can use the blanket
method and have the overlap only on one side on the bottom and it
doesn't matter. I haven't covered a Fairchild fuselage yet but the one I
removed from mine was an envelope and seemed to fit pretty well. I think
the sheet method takes more time but is less expensive and either can be
made to look nice. . A really great guy to buy Poly Fiber from and get
any tips and advice from is Norm Douthit @ 1-888-811-2232. I think Norm
was with Ray Stits from the beginning and probably knows about as much
about Poly Fiber as anyone. There are some mixing formulas that aren't
in the covering manual that can make the painting much easier-if you use
Poly Fiber check with either Norm or I about this. There is also a
covering video you can get that really helps that you can get.I usually
use the Poly Tone on the fabric and Aerothane (with flattener) on the
metal parts. I am using Aerothane for the fabric and the metal parts on
the Fairchild . The Aerothane is a little less user friendly until you
get used to it and is harder to blend in if you have to repair something
but has a better shine and is really durable and resistant to almost
everything.
Good luck covering the fuselage-wish I could be there to help
Buell
james chybicki wrote:
I have used Poly Fiber for several projects and have had really
good luck with it. The first plane I used it on was my Taylorcraft in
1991 and it still looks about like it did when I first covered it. I
have covered both with envelopes and sheets and have found that the
envelopes from Aircraft Spruce work really well especially on wings
because you don't end up with the fabric overlapping on the leading and
trailing edges which take some extra painting and sanding to get rid
of. On the horizontal stabilizers and elevators you can use the blanket
method and have the overlap only on one side on the bottom and it
doesn't matter. I haven't covered a Fairchild fuselage yet but the one I
removed from mine was an envelope and seemed to fit pretty well. I think
the sheet method takes more time but is less expensive and either can be
made to look nice. . A really great guy to buy Poly Fiber from and get
any tips and advice from is Norm Douthit @ 1-888-811-2232. I think Norm
was with Ray Stits from the beginning and probably knows about as much
about Poly Fiber as anyone. There are some mixing formulas that aren't
in the covering manual that can make the painting much easier-if you use
Poly Fiber check with either Norm or I about this. There is also a
covering video you can get that really helps that you can get.I usually
use the Poly Tone on the fabric and Aerothane (with flattener) on the
metal parts. I am using Aerothane for the fabric and the metal parts on
the Fairchild . The Aerothane is a little less user friendly until you
get used to it and is harder to blend in if you have to repair something
but has a better shine and is really durable and resistant to almost
everything.
Good luck covering the fuselage-wish I could be there to help
Buell
james chybicki wrote:
'>
> Hi Fairchild club
>
> Not to start a great big depate, but Bob and I are
> ready to cover our UC-61K Fuselage!!!!
> What's better a envelope or sheets?
> We are leaning toward the Poly Fiber application
> process, It appears to be the most user friendly.
> Is there any critical area's that a club memeber has
> found through restoring a F24 or old school knowledge?
> Any information and or guidance will be greatful!
>
> Thanks
> Keep 'Em Flying
> Jim Chybicki / Bob Coon
> UC-61K 43-14964 N24FM
>
> ____________ _________ _________ _________ _________ __
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail. yahoo.com
>
>
-
Steve Link
- Posts: 104
- Joined: Thu Nov 23, 2006 5:37 pm
Re: Covering our Baby
'Not to throw a monkey wrench into the works, but I'm really leaning towards the Stewart System when I redo my Citabria.... http://www.stewartsystems.aero/
The paint is a waterbased type and will work on fabric, metal and even will go over an existing dope job with normal scuffing. I really like the fact that you can use the same paint on fabric or metal with no color shift like with other systems. The other paints say they match, but a close look reveals a difference between the two.... just my two cents to think about and confuse ya. ;o)
The paint is a waterbased type and will work on fabric, metal and even will go over an existing dope job with normal scuffing. I really like the fact that you can use the same paint on fabric or metal with no color shift like with other systems. The other paints say they match, but a close look reveals a difference between the two.... just my two cents to think about and confuse ya. ;o)
'----- Original Message -----
From: james chybicki
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Monday, April 23, 2007 9:35 AM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Covering our Baby
Hi Fairchild club
Not to start a great big depate, but Bob and I are
ready to cover our UC-61K Fuselage!!!!
What's better a envelope or sheets?
We are leaning toward the Poly Fiber application
process, It appears to be the most user friendly.
Is there any critical area's that a club memeber has
found through restoring a F24 or old school knowledge?
Any information and or guidance will be greatful!
Thanks
Keep 'Em Flying
Jim Chybicki / Bob Coon
UC-61K 43-14964 N24FM
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
-
Tom Downey
- Posts: 216
- Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2001 11:28 pm
Re: Covering our Baby
'http://www.stewartsystems.aero/
really like the fact that you can use the same paint on fabric or
metal with no color shift like with other systems. The other paints
say they match, but a close look reveals a difference between the
two.... just my two cents to think about and confuse ya. ;o)
When you consider the cost of shipping haz-mat these days, and the
health issues with all the polly products, it is safier and cheaper
to do the AFS system, and it is every bit as good or better shine
than any other system.
But the best product they sell is the "EVERSHIELD" protectant.
WE did the front of our camp trailer and the bugs that get smashed
on, fall off after they dry. Nothing absolutely nothing sticks to
it. Any part that has it on will never rust or corrode. Polished
aluminum surfaces stay polished, they do not need polishing ever
agine.
It goes on like oil, but drys clear, 4 oz covered the whole front of
the trailer, the chrome wheels, and trim.
read the web page, it does, what they say it does.'
even will go over an existing dope job with normal scuffing. I> The paint is a waterbased type and will work on fabric, metal and
really like the fact that you can use the same paint on fabric or
metal with no color shift like with other systems. The other paints
say they match, but a close look reveals a difference between the
two.... just my two cents to think about and confuse ya. ;o)
When you consider the cost of shipping haz-mat these days, and the
health issues with all the polly products, it is safier and cheaper
to do the AFS system, and it is every bit as good or better shine
than any other system.
But the best product they sell is the "EVERSHIELD" protectant.
WE did the front of our camp trailer and the bugs that get smashed
on, fall off after they dry. Nothing absolutely nothing sticks to
it. Any part that has it on will never rust or corrode. Polished
aluminum surfaces stay polished, they do not need polishing ever
agine.
It goes on like oil, but drys clear, 4 oz covered the whole front of
the trailer, the chrome wheels, and trim.
read the web page, it does, what they say it does.'
-
Tom Downey
- Posts: 216
- Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2001 11:28 pm
Re: Covering our Baby
'--- In fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com, Buell Powell
wrote:
easier to do and to get right and will look as good as the poly with
out the mess, and the haz-mat. (the Airtech is Haz-Mat) but is very
easy to do, 3 coats of primer filler, sand and paint. It is the only
system that has the plastizer built into the formula which allows the
paint to flex and not crack as the older systems do after a few years.'
wrote:
really>
> Hi Jim,
> I have used Poly Fiber for several projects and have had
It is a great system, but the new Airtech and the AFS systems are way> good luck with it.
easier to do and to get right and will look as good as the poly with
out the mess, and the haz-mat. (the Airtech is Haz-Mat) but is very
easy to do, 3 coats of primer filler, sand and paint. It is the only
system that has the plastizer built into the formula which allows the
paint to flex and not crack as the older systems do after a few years.'
-
David Stroud
- Posts: 171
- Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2003 6:14 am
Re: Covering our Baby
'Not sure what's happening in the South, but apparently the auto
body shops in Canada are just about at the end of their hazardous
rope and will be forced to switch to non hazardous/ emissions products
very soon according to a recent conversation. Likely then that the aircraft
fabric products might be soon to follow? My Fairchild 51 will get done in
non hazmat stuff for sure. Love Mother Earth...? Yes I do.
David Stroud Ottawa, Canada
C-FDWS Christavia
Fairchild 51 under construction
and on the gear...
body shops in Canada are just about at the end of their hazardous
rope and will be forced to switch to non hazardous/ emissions products
very soon according to a recent conversation. Likely then that the aircraft
fabric products might be soon to follow? My Fairchild 51 will get done in
non hazmat stuff for sure. Love Mother Earth...? Yes I do.
David Stroud Ottawa, Canada
C-FDWS Christavia
Fairchild 51 under construction
and on the gear...
'----- Original Message -----
From: Tom Downey
To: fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 5:55 PM
Subject: [fairchildclub] Re: Covering our Baby
--- In fairchildclub@yahoogroups.com, Buell Powell
wrote:
>
> Hi Jim,
> I have used Poly Fiber for several projects and have had
really
> good luck with it.
It is a great system, but the new Airtech and the AFS systems are way
easier to do and to get right and will look as good as the poly with
out the mess, and the haz-mat. (the Airtech is Haz-Mat) but is very
easy to do, 3 coats of primer filler, sand and paint. It is the only
system that has the plastizer built into the formula which allows the
paint to flex and not crack as the older systems do after a few years.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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-
ranger440c5
- Posts: 73
- Joined: Fri Dec 14, 2001 9:26 pm
Re: Covering our Baby
'Hasn't been mentioned yet....watch the fabric weight (whoever supplies
it)many oddities await if not addressed. Doesn't matter if the coatings
are waterborne, urethane, vinyl, or dope....the polyester fabric is a
problem waiting to happen.'
it)many oddities await if not addressed. Doesn't matter if the coatings
are waterborne, urethane, vinyl, or dope....the polyester fabric is a
problem waiting to happen.'